tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30114385.post9122296674738717364..comments2023-12-20T08:35:04.633+00:00Comments on Lingua Frankly: Gamification... I'm not a fanTitchhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03003350618976942468noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30114385.post-33596373768648037232013-01-24T10:15:10.113+00:002013-01-24T10:15:10.113+00:00You always ask the difficult questions, RR....
Be...You always ask the difficult questions, RR....<br /><br />Benny's probably right that there will always be <i>some</i> level of frustration, but one of the reasons that Benny gets my back up so much is that he won't discuss stuff.<br /><br />I genuinely believe that a great amount of frustration can be eliminated by good teaching, whereas he seems to have equated teaching with "evasion" of frustration -- avoiding "real" language, hence never encountering frustration.<br /><br />It's true that a teacher can't anticipate the learner's every need, and even if they could, there's still always going to be an order of teaching, and some things will not be available to the learner until they reach that stage.<br /><br />I'm of the school of thought that says "don't work hard, work smart", but I couple with the pragmatic view of "if you can't work smart, work hard".<br /><br />But fun vs effort... that will require some thought.Titchhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03003350618976942468noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30114385.post-11542355165378414592013-01-24T00:25:02.692+00:002013-01-24T00:25:02.692+00:00Nice post (as usual). Can I be a bit cheeky and re...Nice post (as usual). Can I be a bit cheeky and request you write a post about fun versus effort in learning? <br /><br />I think it is true that it is the learning itself that is most enjoyable and motivating; but equally I think that there is a lot of truth in the view that it takes a lot of hard work and effort to learn anything worthwhile. An example of what I mean is this article (www.fluentin3months.com/comfort/), which I think makes some extremely valid and useful points but seems somehow to be missing something important (really sorry to use an example from Benny, I'm honestly not trying to bait you, I respect the guy (I know you do too) and it was this article that started me thinking quite some months ago. If you ever do have the chance to write the requested post, I obviously don't expect you to reference this article). <br /><br />I remember using MT when starting out and it was an incredibly enjoyable experience; but (marketing hype be apart!) it wasn't effortless, more that the effort itself was somehow "effortless" (you can see I can't quite get my thoughts clear on this, hence the request)...I suppose "rapt" is a good word to describe my state. The only thing that *is* clear is that too many of us wrongly equate hard work with drudgery (perhaps because for so many of us that is true in oiur jobs). Anyway, I understand totally if you're too busy. Thanks for taking the time to read this.random reviewnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30114385.post-18541081400684346352012-12-20T12:31:25.542+00:002012-12-20T12:31:25.542+00:00I think the big problem with most "controlled...I think the big problem with most "controlled" practice is that it's too narrowly focused, and it becomes a mechanical, meaningless task.<br /><br />There has to be a lot of variety, because the students have to need to think about what language feature to choose.<br /><br />But the task description needs to be able to demonstrate quickly and effortlessly to the student what is expected of them.<br /><br />Which always leads me to the conclusion that the only effective task for grammar learning is translation.<br /><br />Properly written native language prompts are understood with no need for any conscious "decoding" of the intended meaning or the task required.<br /><br />This is why Michel Thomas's courses have proved so popular -- it engages through constant variety and manipulation of the target language.Titchhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03003350618976942468noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30114385.post-53713712326251873272012-12-20T10:13:45.179+00:002012-12-20T10:13:45.179+00:00Hello Niall, thanks for the reply.
Maybe my defin...Hello Niall, thanks for the reply.<br /><br />Maybe my definition was a little limited. So learning = instruction + practice. And engagement and enjoyment are the byproducts of learning. Now, making instruction engaging seems fairly systematic: connecting new information to what is already known, providing varied examples, clarifying any ambiguities. Yet making practice engaging is very hit-or-miss: too repetitive and students get bored; too hyperfocused and they get confused; too loose and the practice has the same problems as "free practice" that you've mentioned in your reply. With more complex tasks like essays there's a host of variables that can make writing a frustrating experience for the student. And here lies the temptation to use "gameification", as a way to ensure the fun part of practice, if only superficially (that video...dressing up and playing D&D in class seems awfully tedious unless you enjoy LARPing).<br /><br />What I'm still struggling with in class is: what kind of practices ensure maximum engagement without relying on so-called "fun" activites TESOL and CELTA courses use as crutches?Yousefnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30114385.post-49273628436902767372012-12-18T09:53:43.630+00:002012-12-18T09:53:43.630+00:00Hello Yousef, nice to hear from you again.
My vie...Hello Yousef, nice to hear from you again.<br /><br />My view is that the practice is part of the learning process -- I feel your definition of "learning" stops too early.<br /><br />I follow the school of thought defined by Ausubel as "reception learning": we give the students information explicitly (so they "receive" the information) and then they learn it by applying it in varied situations.<br /><br />I'm sure I've commented before on Jan-Arjen Mondria's <a href="http://babylonia.ch/fileadmin/user_upload/documents/2007-2/mondria.pdf" rel="nofollow">myths about language learning</a>. One of Mondria's research projects was to study vocabulary learning and verify whether vocabulary learned by inference from context was learned any better than vocabulary that was initially given by the teacher. (This is therefore "discovery learning" vs "reception learning".) His findings (summarised under myth 5) said that the method of introduction of vocabulary didn't change the amount of practice required to learn it, and it wasn't until they were quite sure about their inferred meaning that they really started to learn it.<br /><br />His research is consistent with my view that practice is part of learning, not a separate thing.<br /><br />One thing I find problematic is "free practice", because students tend to avoid the new language features as too difficult. When I was studying for my CELTA certificate, that was justified away by the trainers as a sign that they had different "levels" of language, and they only used the "safe" stuff in free practice, and that the new material would become "safe" later. But how can it without further practice if practice is a crucial component of the learning process...?Titchhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03003350618976942468noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30114385.post-62064087123694233152012-12-17T18:29:26.437+00:002012-12-17T18:29:26.437+00:00I really enjoy reading this blog because you analy...I really enjoy reading this blog because you analyze methods and ideas in a way that show how they work (or don't work!); that critical stance is very refreshing and helps me think clearly both as a language teacher and as a language learner. A lot of other language learning resources just tend to accept things on face value.<br /><br />I definitely agree with the idea that learning is inherently fun. By learning I mean the taking in, or discovering of information. But most classrooms have another component as well: practice, the repetition and reinforcement of what was learned, such as essay writing or listening/reading exercises. In class, students seem to enjoy the learning process, but definitely not the practice. I think that it could be one of two things: the students haven't learned properly, making the practice sort of a muddle, or the system itself is flawed and there needs to be a new way to practice. Would be very interested to hear your insights about it!Yousefnoreply@blogger.com